Private School Recruiting Hurting Public School Sports?

[BrickCity]

Jackson area is ground zero for private schools to pluck a few players out of each school every single year.

Hurting the smaller schools

[coastfootballfanman]

I say no because the vast majority of public schools (especially in the Jackson area) are doing the same. High School football (much like College already has) is on its way to being the wild west. Look at Mobile and Baldwin counties in Alabama. Public and Private are recruiting and battling for kids like crazy. 

[TheAnswer]

coastfootballfanman hit the nail on the head. It goes both ways. However it’s getting out of hand when a St Joe daddy is paying for 10+ players tuition and extra incentives.

[s1nglewing]

2 minutes ago, TheAnswer said:

coastfootballfanman hit the nail on the head. It goes both ways. However it’s getting out of hand when a St Joe daddy is paying for 10+ players tuition and extra incentives.

 

... and SJ actually has a coach instead of a talk show host. Might be an interesting season for the Bruins.

[Raiders 10]

I say no private school don't hurt public school from recruiting

[longhorn75]

Not at all. Public schools do have an advantage in a more sizable talent pool and not having most if not all of their student intakes arrive through marketing and advertising. In addition, a school making pitches to students and parents is how these private schools stay in business. Students are drawn to private schools for different reasons, athletics, good academics, their friends going there, ability to participate in certain activities, among other reasons. 

 

Now, as it pertains to providing financial consideration to athletes solely based on their athletic abilities, that is a practice that should not be made common. However, schools just showing what they offer to students, on the academic or athletic side, without any financial remuneration seems fine by me.

[Rebel Bert]

4 hours ago, s1nglewing said:

 

... and SJ actually has a coach instead of a talk show host. Might be an interesting season for the Bruins.

Smith County boy as their coach

[Merlin]

Not yet but it soon will.

 

South Jones had a 9th grader in basketball last year lead their varsity team to the playoffs for the first time that I can honestly remember.  Over the summer it was announced that he would be going to MRA.  That’s just over 2 hours away.  There was an article in local paper that was very similar to a kids college signing day article. 

Edited August 19, 2022 by Merlin

[MadisonReb10]

It likely depends on the area honestly. I could see delta schools pulling players into private schools as well as some of the rural areas or academically bad school districts like JPS. I don’t think the big time public schools are losing starters to private schools but they can lose valuable back ups that would start the following year. The Jackson schools lose players to JA, Prep, and MRA for better academics as well as football as bad as it may seem.

[Washed_Up_Athlete]

22 hours ago, TheAnswer said:

coastfootballfanman hit the nail on the head. It goes both ways. However it’s getting out of hand when a St Joe daddy is paying for 10+ players tuition and extra incentives.

Hartfield is doing the same.

[Washed_Up_Athlete]

19 hours ago, longhorn75 said:

Not at all. Public schools do have an advantage in a more sizable talent pool and not having most if not all of their student intakes arrive through marketing and advertising. In addition, a school making pitches to students and parents is how these private schools stay in business. Students are drawn to private schools for different reasons, athletics, good academics, their friends going there, ability to participate in certain activities, among other reasons. 

 

Now, as it pertains to providing financial consideration to athletes solely based on their athletic abilities, that is a practice that should not be made common. However, schools just showing what they offer to students, on the academic or athletic side, without any financial remuneration seems fine by me.

All true, but financial remuneration solely for athletic purposes is widespread. As previously referenced, a particular high-profile player's dad at St. Joe is paying for many, if not most, of their starters to attend school there solely so they can play football with his son. Hartfield also has a booster paying for similar number of players to attend solely to play football. Greenville Christian had an entire team of kids whose tuition was covered by a booster. MRA has had boosters sponsoring players for years. JA to a lesser extent, and Prep to much lesser extent.

 

The issue is that (1) the rule is very difficult to enforce and (2) the MAIS leadership is apparently not inclined to do so, likely because Blanton is a MRA supporter and MRA is an historical offender. 

[s1nglewing]

7 minutes ago, Washed_Up_Athlete said:

All true, but financial remuneration solely for athletic purposes is widespread. As previously referenced, a particular high-profile player's dad at St. Joe is paying for many, if not most, of their starters to attend school there solely so they can play football with his son. Hartfield also has a booster paying for similar number of players to attend solely to play football. Greenville Christian had an entire team of kids whose tuition was covered by a booster. MRA has had boosters sponsoring players for years. JA to a lesser extent, and Prep to much lesser extent.

 

The issue is that (1) the rule is very difficult to enforce and (2) the MAIS leadership is apparently not inclined to do so, likely because Blanton is a MRA supporter and MRA is an historical offender. 

 

MAIS Financial Consideration eligibility is stringent regarding financial aid from the school or an affiliated association (like booster clubs) but is very slim on guidance or rules with regard to an individual paying for a student(s) tuition. The Catholic schools also provide tuition assistance for students/parents who have no way to pay/attend. There are students at SJ whose parents pay $25/month in tuition (no one goes for free) and the rest the church covers. It's been like that at the Parochial schools forever as far as I know, especially if the student is Catholic.

[Dubaction]

Public schools have a much better brand of football and basketball than private schools in Mississippi. Always have and always will. A few kids here and there that can’t start at a public school won’t make a difference. Especially not enough to say it’s “hurting”. 

[lionpack]

Lamar has plucked good players from Northeast Lauderdale for years.  Might not have made a huge difference at NE but some have been impact players for Lamar.

[Washed_Up_Athlete]

2 hours ago, s1nglewing said:

 

MAIS Financial Consideration eligibility is stringent regarding financial aid from the school or an affiliated association (like booster clubs) but is very slim on guidance or rules with regard to an individual paying for a student(s) tuition. The Catholic schools also provide tuition assistance for students/parents who have no way to pay/attend. There are students at SJ whose parents pay $25/month in tuition (no one goes for free) and the rest the church covers. It's been like that at the Parochial schools forever as far as I know, especially if the student is Catholic.

MAIS Handbook Rule VH contains certain " Signs of Misguided and Faulty Financial Aid". Among these are: (1) "A pattern of transfers into an athletic program receiving financial aid, especially at the senior high level," (2) "Shear numbers of athletes receiving financial aid," (3) "Aid to athletes coming from one source, or benefactor, over an extended period of time," and (4) "Consistent reports from other member schools that a problem exists with the competitions financial aid as it relates to recruiting."

 

I don't know whether member schools have complained about "misguided and faulty financial aid" at other programs, but the first three are surely met with regard to Greenville Christian, St. Joe, and Hartfield.

 

[s1nglewing]

Financial aid is offered through the school. So #1 & 2 are moot with regard to MSJ. #3 depends on what defines an extended period of time.   #4 IDK

[longhorn75]

3 hours ago, Washed_Up_Athlete said:

All true, but financial remuneration solely for athletic purposes is widespread. As previously referenced, a particular high-profile player's dad at St. Joe is paying for many, if not most, of their starters to attend school there solely so they can play football with his son. Hartfield also has a booster paying for similar number of players to attend solely to play football. Greenville Christian had an entire team of kids whose tuition was covered by a booster. MRA has had boosters sponsoring players for years. JA to a lesser extent, and Prep to much lesser extent.

 

The issue is that (1) the rule is very difficult to enforce and (2) the MAIS leadership is apparently not inclined to do so, likely because Blanton is a MRA supporter and MRA is an historical offender. 

You cannot stop a generous mom/dad from paying for kids to go to school. There's an inherent freedom in how you pay their money. If they want to know that they found a way to pay for some kids education, more power to them. However, the issue is when the school-affiliated booster club provides a financial incentive. That is why MRA went down with the sanctions back in the 90s. So, the financial aid came from the school. These benefactor boosters, unfortunately are a part of it. However, the only thing that the MAIS can theoretically enforce to the full level are the school-sanctioned programs doing it. 

[Washed_Up_Athlete]

On 8/19/2022 at 4:20 PM, longhorn75 said:

You cannot stop a generous mom/dad from paying for kids to go to school. There's an inherent freedom in how you pay their money. If they want to know that they found a way to pay for some kids education, more power to them. However, the issue is when the school-affiliated booster club provides a financial incentive. That is why MRA went down with the sanctions back in the 90s. So, the financial aid came from the school. These benefactor boosters, unfortunately are a part of it. However, the only thing that the MAIS can theoretically enforce to the full level are the school-sanctioned programs doing it. 

"Aid to athletes coming from one source, or benefactor, over an extended period of time," is a sign of faulty financial aid. While I understand what you're saying, a single booster paying for athletes to attend a school solely for athletic purposes violates the rule. After all, "booster clubs" are nothing more than one or more boosters with a title. Drop the title, and its the same people doing the same thing. That's why the title isn't determinative. 

 

The reality, IMHO, is that the MAIS will not enforce the rule until an offender is going 90 in a 55 MPH zone and threating the real powers in the association. While Greenville Christian plainly violated the rule last year, the MAIS looked the other way because the school was a national story and everyone knew it was likely a one-off year. St. Joe isn't really competitive (it just got pounded by Copiah, which got pounded last year by the worst J. Prep team in decades), so no one is really complaining. 

[Tiburon]

nothing new.

[msaisbandkid]

On 8/18/2022 at 11:17 AM, BrickCity said:

Jackson area is ground zero for private schools to pluck a few players out of each school every single year.

Hurting the smaller schools

No Private schools get recruits who are either looking for better academics or playing time. You don't see major D1 prospects from Madison Central, Germantown, Brandon, NW Rankin, etc. transfer to one of the private schools. Jackson Academy gets a lot of ex-JPS kids because of its location and the fact that JPS is a dumpster fire of a school system.

[Rebel Bert]

3 Factors here:

1 Public School parents are fed up with politics and the lack of discipline so they transfer their  kids.

2) Parents sometimes move from let's say Hattiesburg to Jackson. Then the parents gave to choose between say NW Rankin and Prep/Hartfield or MC and MRA.

3 Locally it depends if you can afford it between Taylorsville/Raleigh or Sylva Bay and Magee/Mendenhall vs Simpson Academy. And yes the lack of discipline, forced giving of grades for play and the board has ruined Simpson County.

[msaisbandkid]

2 minutes ago, Rebel Bert said:

3 Factors here:

1 Public School parents are fed up with politics and the lack of discipline so they transfer their  kids.

2) Parents sometimes move from let's say Hattiesburg to Jackson. Then the parents gave to choose between say NW Rankin and Prep/Hartfield or MC and MRA.

3 Locally it depends if you can afford it between Taylorsville/Raleigh or Sylva Bay and Magee/Mendenhall vs Simpson Academy. And yes the lack of discipline, forced giving of grades for play and the board has ruined Simpson County.

Agreed. There are only a few good school districts in Mississippi. COVID has exposed this furthermore. Maybe these public school systems in these areas will see how bad their athletics are and figure out that their academics and policies are the problem.

[BrickCity]

2 hours ago, msaisbandkid said:

Agreed. There are only a few good school districts in Mississippi. COVID has exposed this furthermore. Maybe these public school systems in these areas will see how bad their athletics are and figure out that their academics and policies are the problem.

I agree with this. Too many public schools that have high potential that are missing out on their opportunity. I am a big believer in successful athletics= successful school district

[s1nglewing]

On 8/22/2022 at 11:46 AM, Washed_Up_Athlete said:

"Aid to athletes coming from one source, or benefactor, over an extended period of time," is a sign of faulty financial aid. While I understand what you're saying, a single booster paying for athletes to attend a school solely for athletic purposes violates the rule. After all, "booster clubs" are nothing more than one or more boosters with a title. Drop the title, and its the same people doing the same thing. That's why the title isn't determinative. 

 

The reality, IMHO, is that the MAIS will not enforce the rule until an offender is going 90 in a 55 MPH zone and threating the real powers in the association. While Greenville Christian plainly violated the rule last year, the MAIS looked the other way because the school was a national story and everyone knew it was likely a one-off year. St. Joe isn't really competitive (it just got pounded by Copiah, which got pounded last year by the worst J. Prep team in decades), so no one is really complaining. 

MAIS and previously MPSA generally enforces MAIS to MAIS transfers. If a student/athlete transfers from a public school to a MAIS school it's just business. Private schools are basically private enterprises so if a family wants their kid to go there it's good. There isn't really any infraction if a previously public school student, athlete or not, wishes to attend an MAIiS school.  It depends on the particular school's requirements for attendance. If a student has a good record of academics and little in the way of disciplinary issues they will be accepted for attendance. If they're punks they won't,  no matter how athletic they may be. The end game for MAIS is education, not athletics. 

[Washed_Up_Athlete]

10 hours ago, s1nglewing said:

MAIS and previously MPSA generally enforces MAIS to MAIS transfers. If a student/athlete transfers from a public school to a MAIS school it's just business. Private schools are basically private enterprises so if a family wants their kid to go there it's good. There isn't really any infraction if a previously public school student, athlete or not, wishes to attend an MAIS school.  It depends on the particular school's requirements for attendance. If a student has a good record of academics and little in the way of disciplinary issues they will be accepted for attendance. If they're punks they won't,  no matter how athletic they may be. The end game for MAIS is education, not athletics. 

Everything you say is accurate, but that's not what I addressed. I addressed financial aid violations, which are plainly happening at Hartfield, St. Joe, and Greenville Christian. I mean - it's not even a secret. Anyone who knows anything about what's going on at each of these places can tell you who is paying for which kids to play football at the schools.

 

Your post does raise another point: The goal of transfer and financial aid rules is to preserve somewhat level playing fields for the schools. Yet, the MAIS vigorously enforces the transfer rule between MAIS schools, many times causing families to incur thousand of dollars in financial losses just so their kid can have the best chance to develop and succeed in a positive environment. This happens every single year. The MAIS does not, however, enforce the financial aid rules with the same level of vigor, thereby allowing flagrant violators to compete on an unlevel playing field and encouraging other schools to similarly violate the rule in order to keep up. 

 

You see this play out on this very board. Every time the topic of financial aid violations is brought up, multiple posters will come in and mention MRA's apparent financial aid violations over the last several decades in an effort to justify what Greenville Christian did.