New Head at PCS

[FBdude]

6 minutes ago, RUNNINGMAN67 said:

Oh so he didn't break a rule 

Not if he was born in august.  The rule in Louisiana is Sept 1. Years ago that resulted in West Monroe’s best player transferring to River Oaks academy 

[TheAnswer]

 Nothing wrong with holding back in 8th grade. Know plenty that have done that, as long as they turn 19 after August 1.

[RMcCormick66]

I feel like you hear the ole, "public schools better watch out", every time any private school hires a new coach. 

[s1nglewing]

3 hours ago, Washed_Up_Athlete said:

Context matters. Some boys are probably too young for their grade and would benefit socially, academically, and athletically from holding back. A strong case can be made in favor of a young man being 18 years old for most of his senior year. It is true that parents hold kids back at many schools for these legitimate reasons. 

 

This, however, is not what is occurring at MRA. 18 boys in the 8th grade are holding back this year. The MRA athletic department is not only encouraging this - it's part of the school's competitive strategy. Heck, there are a few families who are refusing to hold their kids back and leaving the school this year because of the unfair advantage created by having 19 year olds competing against 18 year 

Holding back for competitive advantage is a large part of the equation for parents who do so.

[s1nglewing]

1 hour ago, RMcCormick66 said:

I feel like you hear the ole, "public schools better watch out", every time any private school hires a new coach. 

This particular new coach is very well known in Alabama for snatching the best from surrounding schools. USA Today even did a write-up about him.

[coastfootballfanman]

7 hours ago, Vott said:

Not drinking the kool aid on that. No way if you are a big time player at HHS, Petal, or OG are you leaving to go to PCS. Purvis or Sumrall maybe but not a 5a or 6a school. 

Not saying you have to drink the look aid or that he’s going to get a bunch of kids in. I just stated he is going to try. The guy they hired, he is going to shake every tree in the area to get kids. Middle school-high school. I am just the messenger. Money and resources are about to start coming at PCS. They would not have made this hire if things were not going to be heading in that direction. He may not get a single kid from OG or Hattiesburg, but I promise you he is going to go after them all 

[coastfootballfanman]

4 hours ago, RMcCormick66 said:

I feel like you hear the ole, "public schools better watch out", every time any private school hires a new coach. 

You might be right, but in this case, I promise you it is warranted. 

[Dubaction]

If a kid leaves the Big 3 in the pine belt to go to PCS it’s solely because they have a better chance of getting on the field there. That’s it. 

[TheAnswer]

7 hours ago, TheAnswer said:

 Nothing wrong with holding back in 8th grade. Know plenty that have done that, as long as they turn 19 after August 1.

Also to add, MAIS rule is that once you start 9th grade, you only have 4 years to play varsity. Once you reach 7th grade, you have 3 years for junior high. Most 9th graders don’t get varsity playing time. Therefore, repeating 8th grade is very beneficial. As a second year 8th grader, they can still play varsity but it not count towards their eligibility. 

[TheAnswer]

Carr will give Herbert Davis at MRA and Pastor McClendon at Greenville Christian University a run for their money as the best recruiter in the state.

[s1nglewing]

2 hours ago, TheAnswer said:

Carr will give Herbert Davis at MRA and Pastor McClendon at Greenville Christian University a run for their money as the best recruiter in the state.

Different markets, too. Should be interesting.

[coastfootballfanman]

12 hours ago, Dubaction said:

If a kid leaves the Big 3 in the pine belt to go to PCS it’s solely because they have a better chance of getting on the field there. That’s it. 

"If you build it, they will come". Again, I am not saying this guy is going to grab all this talent from those schools, but he is going to try his hardest. A lot of schools in the Jackson area used to say the same thing about MRA and look at what they have become the last several years. The kids at the High School level probably will be okay. It is the ones in middle school that Carr is going to target. PCS does not make this hire if they are not committed to putting money and resources behind Carr. 

[Washed_Up_Athlete]

27 minutes ago, coastfootballfanman said:

"If you build it, they will come". Again, I am not saying this guy is going to grab all this talent from those schools, but he is going to try his hardest. A lot of schools in the Jackson area used to say the same thing about MRA and look at what they have become the last several years. The kids at the High School level probably will be okay. It is the ones in middle school that Carr is going to target. PCS does not make this hire if they are not committed to putting money and resources behind Carr. 

This is why many MAIS folks have believed PCS is a sleeping giant. You are 100% correct.

[longhorn75]

20 hours ago, JACKTOWN91 said:

Dang I thought the rule was that you can't be 19 when the school year begins.

 

21 hours ago, Washed_Up_Athlete said:

No MAIS schools are allowed to give athletic scholarships. They cannot provide financial aid based solely on athletic ability. They can, however, provide financial aid for demonstrated financial need. What happens is that a family applies for financial aid from the school and receives some portion of reduced tuition. That difference gets paid for by a third-party. Having a third-party pay the tuition for athletic reasons is also against MAIS rules, but the rule is unenforced. Numerous people can tell you who is paying the way for kids at MRA, Hartfield, St. Joe, and Greenville Christian. It's no secret.

 

But, the MAIS is headed by Stone Blanton's dad. Stone Blanton's mom works at MRA. MRA is one of the biggest - if not the biggest - offenders. And the biggest punishment (if not one of the only punishments) ever applied by the MAIS for illegal sponsoring of athletes was against MRA. Of course, the MAIS had a different head at the time. 

 

Additionally, while on the topic of MRA, the school encourages its athletic boys to hold-back a grade. This year's 8th grade is holding-back 18 boys. Stone Blanton will be nearly 20 YEARS OLD when he graduates high school. These kids will follow that model. 

 

As for PCS, many have long thought it's a sleeping giant. Just as MRA is geographically positioned well (surrounded by Ridgeland, Madison Central, Germantown, NW Rankin, and NE Jackson), PCS is also positioned well. If the new coach gets to work on increasing its talent pool, and if he finally starts running a modern offense, PCS could become a legitimate force in MAIS 6A.

 

 

PCS also has a great tradition in track since its inception. That's what made it such a great building project when Joey Hawkins went there and made them into a contender in football, and a powerhouse in Boy's Track until he retired.  Regarding MRA's; most of the people who were in the football scandal on that are long gone. In fact, MRA cleaned house right after those sanctions got levied.  Now there have been stories about parents that have put their kids in school there and have on their own paid for students so that their child had a really good team to play with, and honestly, you can't stop a parent from doing that. Is it insane? Yes, but at the end of the day, it's their money. Now if the booster club or the school was paying players, then it's wrong. 

 

With regard to PCS, this is a slam dunkthire they've made potentially equaling the Joey Hawkins hire in 2009. It's quite amazing that JA, Prep, and PCS all have new football coaches this year. And all are seasoned coaches from Alabama. 

[Washed_Up_Athlete]

12 hours ago, TheAnswer said:

Also to add, MAIS rule is that once you start 9th grade, you only have 4 years to play varsity. Once you reach 7th grade, you have 3 years for junior high. Most 9th graders don’t get varsity playing time. Therefore, repeating 8th grade is very beneficial. As a second year 8th grader, they can still play varsity but it not count towards their eligibility. 

This is true. It is also true that Blanton did not break the rule by holding back two grades. He pushed up to the line, but he didn't violate the rule. The issue - to the extent you consider it to be a real issue - is that MRA is holding back nearly entire classes of football-playing boys solely for football reasons. While kids have been held back for decades, never has it been this widescale, in your face, and driven solely for competitive advantage. You've had schools in the past that have had two or three holdbacks, but nothing like this. 

 

But the holdback matter cannot be viewed in a vacuum. It has to viewed in combination with MRA's athletic recruiting and sponsoring of players. Example: MRA goes to the family of an 8th grader at Germantown and tells them their son can come to MRA free of charge. The kid enrolls, has good year, and then the school tells the family that it strongly encourages them to hold their son back. The family holds the kid back, in part because they're not paying tuition anyway. 

 

This scenario is what it is occurring on a widescale basis. MRA will have success with it. But at some point there will be a severe backlash from other MAIS member schools and/or MRA families who object. How things play out from there will be interesting.

Edited May 20, 2022 by Washed_Up_Athlete

[coastfootballfanman]

1 minute ago, Washed_Up_Athlete said:

This is true. It is also true that Blanton did not break the rule with his by holding back two grades. He pushed up to the line, but it met the rule. The issue - to the extent you consider it to be a real issue - is that MRA is holding back nearly entire classes of football-playing boys solely for football reasons. While kids have been held back for decades, never has it been this widescale and driven solely for competitive advantage. You've had schools in the past that have had two or three holdbacks, but nothing like this. 

 

But the holdback matter cannot be viewed in a vacuum. It has to viewed in combination with MRA's athletic recruiting and sponsoring of players. Example: MRA goes to the family of an 8th grader at Germantown and tells them their son can come to MRA free of charge. The kid enrolls, has good year, and then the school tells the family that it strongly encourages them to hold their son back. The family holds the kid back, in part because they're not paying tuition anyway. 

 

This scenario is what is occurring. MRA will have success with it. But at some point there will be a severe backlash from other MAIS member schools and/or MRA families who object. How things play out from there will be interesting.

There will never be backlash from MRA for it. Herb Davis has a well oiled machine and nobody is going to slow it down at MRA. Look at the positive publicity and press they get on a regular basis. The thing people forget is when you allow sports programs (especially at the private schools) to become this big, powerful and successful, there really is not a whole lot you can do to slow it down. They are thriving in all sports just about, and the majority of students there are involved in sports in some capacity as well. 

[Washed_Up_Athlete]

Just now, coastfootballfanman said:

There will never be backlash from MRA for it. Herb Davis has a well oiled machine and nobody is going to slow it down at MRA. Look at the positive publicity and press they get on a regular basis. The thing people forget is when you allow sports programs (especially at the private schools) to become this big, powerful and successful, there really is not a whole lot you can do to slow it down. They are thriving in all sports just about, and the majority of students there are involved in sports in some capacity as well. 

There's already some internal backlash right now. A few families are exploring changing schools, and other families are expressing discontent. But your point is well-taken: whether it amounts to anything or makes any difference remains to be seen. At its current scale, it surely won't.

 

As I mentioned before, it's no secret who is funding the sponsorship at MRA, St. Joe, and Hartfield. And despite what an earlier poster stated, does in fact violate MAIS rules. Whether the MAIS does something about it will largely depend on whether enough other 6A member schools do something. I doubt they will. 

[RMcCormick66]

My question is how do these private schools handle it when a recruit is brought in to play in front of the money guy's kid. They just cool with it?

[Washed_Up_Athlete]

16 minutes ago, RMcCormick66 said:

My question is how do these private schools handle it when a recruit is brought in to play in front of the money guy's kid. They just cool with it?

First, there are different types of "money guys." These are private schools. The overwhelming majority of families are paying full tuition. If you've paid to send your kids to school for years, you're a type of money guy. But there are, at least in some of these schools, a higher level money guy. The type of guy who can, and some who have, funded the entire construction of turf fields, who donate money to school for a variety of purposes, and who independently pay for things. These are the "real" money guys, in the sense that the schools cannot afford to upset them. Then, there's a third type who's not necessarily the biggest giver, but who has influence in the school, maybe because he's on the board or because he's been a longtime supporter that a lot of people like and respect in the school. 

 

Schools can many times afford to upset the first type. They run into issues when the upset the latter two.

 

Now on the recruiting issue, there's a couple of different scenarios that tend to play out. The first situation: you have player who isn't the best, but is good enough to win with. You can get a recruit for the same position. Should you? Probably not, especially if he's the kid of one of the latter two types. The second situation: you don't have a viable player for a position. You can get a recruit for the position. Should you? Yes. 

 

There's more nuance to the issue than this, and each school has unique dynamics, but that's a broad brush answer.

[Vott]

15 hours ago, TheAnswer said:

Also to add, MAIS rule is that once you start 9th grade, you only have 4 years to play varsity. Once you reach 7th grade, you have 3 years for junior high. Most 9th graders don’t get varsity playing time. Therefore, repeating 8th grade is very beneficial. As a second year 8th grader, they can still play varsity but it not count towards their eligibility. 

What kind of student wants to repeat a grade? Its one thing to have to repeat a grade because of poor grades, but to repeat a grade just for the sake of repeating it just wouldnt cut it with me. I couldnt wait to get out of school

[JACKTOWN91]

https://www.montgomeryadvertiser.com/story/news/crime/2021/12/17/state-championship-coach-bobby-carr-gets-pre-trial-diversion-dui-case/8941214002/

 

He got an arrest on his record. Maybe that's why he jumping states?

[longhorn75]

1 hour ago, Washed_Up_Athlete said:

There's already some internal backlash right now. A few families are exploring changing schools, and other families are expressing discontent. But your point is well-taken: whether it amounts to anything or makes any difference remains to be seen. At its current scale, it surely won't.

 

As I mentioned before, it's no secret who is funding the sponsorship at MRA, St. Joe, and Hartfield. And despite what an earlier poster stated, does in fact violate MAIS rules. Whether the MAIS does something about it will largely depend on whether enough other 6A member schools do something. I doubt they will. 

My understanding of the rule is that no financial consideration on athletics by the school or its associated organizations. If that's the case, that's how people are gettin away with it. 

[JACKTOWN91]

https://www.riverregionsports.com/stories/rrs-exclusive-bobby-carrs-coaching-future-takes-unexpected-detour

 

So this guy was also kind of fired from his last school?

[s1nglewing]

3 hours ago, Washed_Up_Athlete said:

This is true. It is also true that Blanton did not break the rule by holding back two grades. He pushed up to the line, but he didn't violate the rule. The issue - to the extent you consider it to be a real issue - is that MRA is holding back nearly entire classes of football-playing boys solely for football reasons. While kids have been held back for decades, never has it been this widescale, in your face, and driven solely for competitive advantage. You've had schools in the past that have had two or three holdbacks, but nothing like this. 

 

But the holdback matter cannot be viewed in a vacuum. It has to viewed in combination with MRA's athletic recruiting and sponsoring of players. Example: MRA goes to the family of an 8th grader at Germantown and tells them their son can come to MRA free of charge. The kid enrolls, has good year, and then the school tells the family that it strongly encourages them to hold their son back. The family holds the kid back, in part because they're not paying tuition anyway. 

 

This scenario is what it is occurring on a widescale basis. MRA will have success with it. But at some point there will be a severe backlash from other MAIS member schools and/or MRA families who object. How things play out from there will be interesting.

Simpson and Leake and others have had entire classes of boys who were held back, so there is precedent.

[s1nglewing]

17 minutes ago, JACKTOWN91 said:

https://www.riverregionsports.com/stories/rrs-exclusive-bobby-carrs-coaching-future-takes-unexpected-detour

 

So this guy was also kind of fired from his last school?

 

That's not what the article from the link you posted says.